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Colorado Cowboy
03-20-2012, 11:19 AM
I have a .50 TC Black Diamond Express front stuffer that I use and am not extremely happy with the bullets I have been using. I have used the Power Point with the plastic cup seal in 290 gr (I think). A couple of years ago I shot a 5x5 bull right behind the shoulder, took out a rib and passed thru w/o expanding! He ran about 100 yards and layed down and died. The part that I dont get is no bullet expansion. Bullet has polymer point, but still went thru and exited. Exit hole was about the same size as entry.

I am looking for a better expanding bullet in the 300 to 400 gr area.

jay
03-20-2012, 02:27 PM
CC, I use the Barnes TMZ sabots in a 250 grain. I used to shoot a black diamond, and on it I used the green powerbelts. Seemed to shoot ok with them but didn't use it very much. When I sold the bd, I bought an Omega and tried to use the powerbelts on it also. I couldn't get them to group for nothing so I switched over to the Barnes. These sabots shoot amazing out of my Omega on paper and on game! They say all muzzleloaders shoot ammo differently so you may need to do some experimenting but these are what worked for me. I just used it this last season and smoked two mulies and a bull elk, and they definitely do the trick. Seems like you prefer a heavier load so these may not work for you but maybe they make them bigger than what I use...the 250 did it for me.

Colorado Cowboy
03-20-2012, 02:51 PM
Only problem is that sabots are illegal here in Colorado. The PB's grouped good, but they just didn't seem to expand the way I thought they should.

Old Hunter
03-20-2012, 03:16 PM
I'm surprised the Powerbelt didn't expand. They usually expand too much and don't penetrate. Some even blow up if the load is too heavy.

This is my Colorado ML bullet. Made by Barnes to full bore specs. Expansion and penetration is perfect. You need to get the proper fit in the bore though. Send him an e-mail, or give him a call. He'll send you out a sample pack of different sizes. Once you decide what size fits you can give him an order. He'll send them out to you, and if you like them you send him a check. If not just send them back. He's a one man operation and a great guy. His name is Terry.

http://thorbullets.com/

Colorado Cowboy
03-20-2012, 05:19 PM
Thanks for the info. I'll send him an email.

FrontierMuzzleloading
03-24-2012, 09:54 PM
Yep, You won't have any problems with the Thors expansion.

Recovered from one deer.
http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/mm53/thepowerbeltforum/Thor%20Bullets/100_8538.jpg

Colorado Cowboy
03-25-2012, 07:19 AM
Sample pack is on the the way. Thanks. Looks like great expansion. Did you weigh the expanded slug to see how much retained weight there was?

Old Hunter
03-25-2012, 08:26 AM
Typical of a Barnes. It will be close to 100%.

Nebraska Outlander
03-25-2012, 08:31 PM
Let us know how the thors shoot out of your gun been thinking of getting these also but have read mixed results. I want to shoot farther ranges than most but that is just me. I have read they do okay for accuracy just not sure if I want to make the switch. I switched to the Barnes myself from reading other post and now I have a box of Barnes I won't be using a 3" group isn't good enough for me. I currently am shooting 100 grains of Blackhorn 209 and 300 Hornady SST's shooting 1 3/8" group at 100 yards. If I could get that with the thors or Hornady FPB which are similar to the thors I might switch to them, bigger holes!!! :)

Well let us know how they do always great to hear how others shoot!!!

Nebraska Outlander

Musket Man
03-25-2012, 09:34 PM
I switched to Hornady FPBs for colorado last year. I havent killed anything with them yet but they seem to shoot well in my knight disc extreme with 100 grains of 777 fffg. I have herd some guns like them and some dont though. I have also herd the power belts can be unreliable

Old Hunter
03-26-2012, 08:11 AM
Let us know how the thors shoot out of your gun been thinking of getting these also but have read mixed results. I want to shoot farther ranges than most but that is just me. I have read they do okay for accuracy just not sure if I want to make the switch. I switched to the Barnes myself from reading other post and now I have a box of Barnes I won't be using a 3" group isn't good enough for me. I currently am shooting 100 grains of Blackhorn 209 and 300 Hornady SST's shooting 1 3/8" group at 100 yards. If I could get that with the thors or Hornady FPB which are similar to the thors I might switch to them, bigger holes!!! :)

Well let us know how they do always great to hear how others shoot!!!

Nebraska Outlander

Not exactly. The Thor is all copper. FPB is jacketed lead.

Thors shot 2" groups @200yds for me from a CVA. You need to have a good fit with BH 209. It takes some compression for BH to be accurate. That's been my experience anyway.

BKC
03-26-2012, 05:25 PM
If my gun would take the hornady FPB, I would shoot them. I shoot 338 grain powerbelts for elk and 295 grain for deer. They are accurate and easy loading. If you take the gas ring off of them the bullet just slips right down the barrel. I always wonder if the rifle got bumped just right with the barrel down, would the bullet slip off the gas ring, would it fall out of the gun? You wouldnt think that the bullet engages the rifiling when fired but when I dig one out of the dirt behing the target, you can see the rifiling on the expanded bullet. I can never find enough of the bullet when I dig it out of the animal. That is the one thing I don't like about the powerbelt, they come apart too fast and fragment. It depends what organs the fragments hit, whether or not the animal goes down right away. They dont like bone! I have taken the hornady FPB and pushed it through the barrel several times and " prestart" them so they are easier to load without the assist of a short starter. It helps a bit but they still push hard and it is tough to get the same seating pressure on each load. I shoot t/c triumph, it must have a smaller barrel than most. Some T/C's like them and some dont.

Musket Man
03-26-2012, 06:32 PM
Sounds like Thor is onto something with slightly different sizes to compensate for the variations in muzzle loaders. Maybe Im just lucky mine likes the FPB's? I shot knight red hots before that but had to switch for colorado last year.

Colorado Cowboy
03-26-2012, 06:56 PM
I got my Thor samples today.....4 different diameters. When I get the right fit and order some, I'll find out how they shoot.

Old Hunter
03-26-2012, 07:25 PM
Push them a bit. 110 gr of BH209 usually works good.

Colorado Cowboy
03-26-2012, 07:59 PM
I usually use APP. Been using 100 grs of it, also use some Goex... real BP.

Old Hunter
03-26-2012, 08:23 PM
Oops! I had to go back to the first post to see what you were shooting. I forgot. Not a fan of APP. I find it very inconsistent. BP is fine, but I usually save it for sidelocks.

Have you tried Pyrodex? Cleaner than BP, and a little more power. Fires off easily with a 209 primer. BH 209 is the best BP sub right now, but it has ignition problems in some guns. I'm not sure how it would work in your gun. There's also Triple 7, but it has it's problems too with a crud ring. If I had your gun, i'd shoot Pyrodex RS (2F), or Pyrodex P (3F) for a hotter load.

8750
03-26-2012, 08:45 PM
BH209 is sooo much better than anything else on the market right now. All it takes is one shooting session and you will be buying in the largest quantity you can get your hands on.

Musket Man
03-26-2012, 09:20 PM
What is better about BH209? I started with pyrodex but switched to 777 because it burned cleaner and I been happy with it so I havent looked any farther.

8750
03-26-2012, 09:26 PM
BH burns clean. very clean. I go about 10-15 shots before even a dry patch. Best of all it is very easy to clean. No more soap, water, windex, or whatever you used to use. Just some good ole Hoppes. Oh and it is very consistant with shot performance. Higher chrony readings. Tighter groups. And it looks cool too! each grain is a little cylinder.

Musket Man
03-26-2012, 09:38 PM
I will have to check it out next time I need powder.

Old Hunter
03-26-2012, 09:46 PM
Basically, BH 209 is a smokeless powder detuned to BP specs. You measure it the same as BP in volume. You use the same solvents to clean it as your CF guns. I've gone as much as 60 shots with easy loading, and no change in accuracy. It doesn't go bad over time, and absorbs almost no moisture. If any at all. It's expensive, but worth it.

However, it has a higher ignition temperature. This causes some problems with some breech plugs. Some can be corrected with a drill. Some can't. Others give 100% ignition from the factory.

FrontierMuzzleloading
03-27-2012, 03:46 PM
Recovered Thor was 247 grains. The ballistic tip weighs 3 grains.

BH209! Its THE best powder on the market IF your muzzle loader can shoot it of course. In your case, i would NOT recommend it as the Blk diamond has throw spent primers into the face of the shooter when using BH209. Best suited for bolt actions and break actions muzzle loaders so you get a good tight seal on the primer.

Colorado Cowboy
04-04-2012, 07:12 PM
Guess my barrel is .503 as this is the one in the sample pack that fit best. I ordered 50 of the 250 grainers. Now All I have to do is see how they shoot.

Old Hunter
04-04-2012, 10:07 PM
I thought you wanted a 300gr?

Colorado Cowboy
04-05-2012, 07:10 AM
After I talked to him and got some typical ballistics, I am trying the 250"s first. Faster and less drop out at 200 yards.

Old Hunter
04-05-2012, 08:24 AM
I agree, and it's what I use. I just didn't want to talk you into it if your mind was set on a heavier bullet. A 250gr bullet is heavy in the CF world. Even if a ML isn't pushing it that fast. It still smacks them.

Colorado Cowboy
04-05-2012, 08:33 AM
I agree...now all I have to do is go shoot them when they arrive.

FrontierMuzzleloading
04-05-2012, 09:43 AM
I'd push them with a minimum of 90gr. Im shooting them out of a sidelock now with 90gr 2f goex and they are tack drivers at 100 yards.

Colorado Cowboy
04-05-2012, 11:08 AM
I've been shooting the 300 grainers with 100 grs of goex. Probably start with 90 and then see what I get.

Old Hunter
04-09-2012, 08:47 AM
Did they work?