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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vanish View Post
    The whole energy independence thing based on oil is baloney. We already ship more crude overseas than we consume.
    This quote alone is so blatant and obviously wrong that it COMPLETELY invalidates everything else that you said. The U.S. produces maybe 7-9 million barrels a day of oil and consumes somewhere around 20 million barrels a day. My numbers might be off just a little but that it is a ridiculous claim to make. Also, I might be wrong about this but I thought that it was actually illegal to sell crude overseas.
    Last edited by NDHunter; 11-08-2012 at 12:47 PM.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by NDHunter View Post
    This quote alone is so blatant and obviously wrong that it COMPLETELY invalidates everything else that you said. The U.S. produces maybe 7-9 million barrels a day of oil and consumes somewhere around 20 million barrels a day. My numbers might be off just a little but that it is a ridiculous claim to make. Also, I might be wrong about this but I thought that it was actually illegal to sell crude overseas.
    I do not know about the amounts, but when you witness oil tankers filling up in Houston, and heading overseas, it does make you wonder. The same thing happened during the tiff with Iran in the seventies, and the answer was that we would continue to supply oil to our allies, which probably explains NDHunter's last comment. We did not sell it, we just gave it to them.
    Patron Life Member, NRA; Life Member RMEF, SCI, NAHHC, NSRPA

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by NDHunter View Post
    This quote alone is so blatant and obviously wrong that it COMPLETELY invalidates everything else that you said. The U.S. produces maybe 7-9 million barrels a day of oil and consumes somewhere around 20 million barrels a day.
    I'm sorry, I meant of the locally produced oil, we ship more of it overseas than we consume. (edit here: I did say crude, and I was wrong, I meant refined.)

    The US is the 9th largest oil exporter in the world.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...by_oil_exports

    The point is ... giving private companies the ability to pull more oil from our lands does nothing at all to ensure that oil stays here.

    Also: net-oil product exporter (that includes gasoline):
    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-0...r-in-2011.html
    Last edited by Vanish; 11-08-2012 at 02:10 PM.
    DIY til I DIE

  4. #34
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    Vanish,

    I honestly hope that no person on this forum would "Crush" you. One of the great things about this site is most people are respectful of the other opinions. That said, I do RESPECTFULLY disagree with you. I believe O'bama will attempt to put more gun control in place now that he has a second term. With Pelosi and Reid still in some power, it will be pushed.

    I don't know all the numbers on the oil issue but have worked on the north slope of Alaska where we have big oil fields. Their footprint is getting smaller and smaller with directional drilling, etc. As a rule, the oil companies up here have been great neighbors and bring plenty of good paying jobs. Our nation can use the oil and the economy can use the jobs.

    We may have to agree to disagree on which political party wants to impose there agendas on each other the most, but I'll bet both you and I would consider ourselves as conservationists and lovers of our wilderness and wildlife. In that spirit, I wish you well and hope you have a safe and enjoyable outdoor season, however you choose to use it.

  5. #35
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    It would be cool if we could always agree. I don't think that it's very much of a surprise that there are some disagreements between the political parties.

    My concern, this being a hunting forum was concern for the second amendment and the removal of gun rights to the honest law abiding citizens. It's my belief that guns and ammunition don't kill people. People kill people. There are some that feel the second amendment should be continually tweaked and regulated either on a state or federal level. I've just felt more support from the Republican side than Democrat side from my view of looking at it. Perhaps it's also just what I see on the California side of politics out my way has swayed me in that direction.

    In the end, we should not pit hunter against hunter. If we can all agree we want to preserve hunting in America on the forum, that perhaps is the common ground between our parties and we should embrace that common ground.

    The other political issues mentioned in this thread are also very important issues that bear concern as one votes but then again that comes from each ones perspective, how they view the issues, their resolutions and their personal beliefs. One may see giving rights where another sees them being taken them away. One may see a right, instead of another seeing a wrong.

    I may have opened up a can of worms on this thread. I for one hold no ill will to folks here with opposing views or political parties. I however and respectfully may disagree with your view.

    Like the thread initially states it's so very important to vote come election day. Just get out and make sure you vote if you can. There are many men and women that have fought or are fighting currently for your freedoms and your privilege to vote.

    I'll continue to pray for our all our leaders Democrat or Republican. It's my belief they all need our prayers. God bless America!

  6. #36
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    Vanish "your" federal lands? That's quite a sense of entitlement you have there.

    If they were really "our" federal lands we could do whatever we wanted on them like hunting in national parks. They are just another government program we need to legislate into a better situation than the one we have.

    Remember we have to take the fight to them, but approaching it like they are taking away an entitlement to me just sounds wrong.

    Wyoming, Montana and Idaho made that mistake with Yellowstone in the 1990s, and look where we are with the wolves.

    We honestly own very little in this life. I would love a conservative grass roots revolution, but this wonderful country of ours has gone to HE double hockey sticks in a hand basket.

  7. #37
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    anyone notice how bad the stocks dropped after election? tells us al something.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by ivorytip View Post
    anyone notice how bad the stocks dropped after election? tells us al something.
    I agree, tells us that the people with money in the stock market have no faith in the results of this election. Rightfully so, being we have been on a downward spiral and continue to overspend and the "fiscal cliff" doesn't seem to be going away. But you heard Obamas plan, the top people will have to pay "a little more" to help all of those that don't even file taxes in this country. That's his only specific plan I've heard...."tax the rich a little more" Did he ever define WHO the rich are and HOW MUCH a little more is? The plan is stupid, it won't make much of a difference for multi-millionaires, they will still be rich, but it will effect our economy because they are the business owners and they will not expand business under this president policies. As for his anti-gun agenda?? Have you never heard of "fast and furious" You can't possibly say that he wants to leave guns alone on the federal level if you know anything about that SCANDAl/COVER-UP. The reason behind that was to give them "ammo" towards more gun control b/c they were going to be able to prove that the guns were going from the u.s. to mexican cartels...thus giving them evidence that they needed to control guns more tightly. I must say my trust goes to the NRA over this administration, very hard for me to believe how any hunter or supporter of the 2nd ammendment could choose otherwise. And Oil...I think it's evident that with this poor economy the oil/gas industry is an immediate response to increase jobs, revenue, and decrease foreign oil dependance. If you don't think it will grow the economy ask North Dakota. Oh and not to mention $4 gas SUCKS. When Bush was pres all you heard about was how terrible $2 gas was under him, now not a peep about the $4 we have under Obama, and that's simply b/c the mainstream media will do everything it can to destroy republicans while covering up for the democratic party. I also believe the mainstream media...CNN, MSNBC, NBC, CBS, ABC... are to blame for a lot of the problems we are facing bc they won't do their job and report on issues without putting their liberal bias spin on everything. Im with BKC on this class warfare, and I just moved UP into "middle class" status 2 years ago. The democrat party painted the successful and wealthy people in this country as an evil greedy bunch to the people that would rather feel sorry for themselves and sit on their asses and wait on the government to give them something other than taking responsibility for their own life and get a damn job. Welfare doesn't help people get out of poverty, it just holds them their keeping them reliant on the gov, just where the dem party wants them to be so they can have forever control over them, in exchange for their vote. Only a job will help a person come out of poverty. If I sound angry in this post it's bc I am, this country will continue to go downhill under this administration.

  9. #39
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    Whatch for the small arms treaty with the un...... It is coming....

 

 

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