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  1. #1
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    Is the THOR bullet now legal for Oregon muzzleloader seasons?

    Is the all copper Barnes X type Thor Bullet now legal for Oregon muzzleloader seasons? The Thor bullets are the rage in Colorado, where full bore conicals are also required (sabots are not allowed in CO). The Thor bullet has been reported as being excellent performers on elk.

    This year the regulations for muzzleloader bullets in Oregon was changed to allow for non-lead full bore conicals to be used in muzzleloader seasons. On page 30 of the 2014 Oregon regulations, the regs state (this is in blue so it is a change for 2014):

    Only conical bullets made of lead, lead alloy, or federally-approved nontoxic shot material, with a length that does not exceed twice the diameter, and round balls made of lead, lead alloy, or federally-approved nontoxic material, used with cloth, paper or felt patches are allowed during muzzleloader-only seasons and 600 series hunts where there is a weapon restriction of shotgun/muzzleloader only or archery/muzzleloader only. It is illegal to hunt with non-lead bullets except for those made of federally-approved nontoxic shot material, jacketed bullets, sabots, and bullets with plastic or synthetic tips or bases during muzzleloader only seasons and 600 series hunts where there is a weapon restriction of shotgun/muzzleloader only.

    I am seriously considering the all copper Thor bullet. These bullets DO NOT use a plastic base, or a sabot but instead have a copper "cup" integrated into the rear of the bullet to seat to the barrel.

    The Thor bullet is an all copper Barnes "X" bullet manufactured for Thor. I believe it should now be legal in Oregon. The 247 grain hollow-point 50 caliber, Thor bullet (non plastic tipped and just under an inch long), meets the requirement of not having the length exceed twice the diameter. It also does not contain any plastic.

    Here is the technicality..… the bullet is pure copper. I don't believe pure copper is on the list of "federally-approved nontoxic shot material", since pure copper is not typically used in bird shot. It does however meet the intent of the change in regulations, which is to move away from bullets containing lead, and copper is a proven performer in big game bullets.

    The negatives are the price (about $1.50 per bullet, so not for target practice) and that you first have to get the sizing kit from Thor which contains four bullets (0.500", 0.501", 0.502" and 0.503") to find the bullet diameter that properly fits the bore of your specific rifle. I have typically heard very good reports about the accuracy of this bullet.

    https://thorbullets.com

    Sizing the bullet to your specific bore. In this video you can also see the hollow-point (non-plastic tipped) Thor.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eDmFUckyCUI

    The 247 grain, 50 caliber, "hollow-point" version (bore sized, 0.953" long, no plastic tip, solid copper):



    Integrated copper "cup" to seal the gasses (no sabot or plastic base used):



    The bullet expanded:

    Last edited by Umpqua Hunter; 07-20-2014 at 03:17 PM.
    Grand Slam #1005 + 2: Dall (1986 Yukon), Fannin/Stone (1987 Yukon), Bighorn (1988 Colorado Unit S-26), Stone (1995 British Columbia), Desert (2001 Nevada Unit 161), Bighorn (2009 Wyoming Unit 5)

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Umpqua Hunter View Post
    Here is the technicality..… the bullet is pure copper. I don't believe pure copper is on the list of "federally-approved nontoxic shot material", since pure copper is not typically used in bird shot.
    That seems to be the question. Is the Thor considered "federally-approved nontoxic shot material".

    http://www.fws.gov/migratorybirds/cu...s/nontoxic.htm
    "Now two flags fly above my land that really sum up how I fee. One is the colors that fly high and proud The red, the white, the blue. The other one's got a rattlesnake With a simple statement made "Don't tread on me" is what it says and I'll take that to my grave. Because this is me. I'm proud to be American and strong in my beliefs. And I've said it before but I'll say it again 'Cause my family's always fought and died to save this land. And a country boy is all I'll ever be."

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Musket Man View Post
    That seems to be the question. Is the Thor considered "federally-approved nontoxic shot material".

    http://www.fws.gov/migratorybirds/cu...s/nontoxic.htm
    Thanks MM, that is the precisely list that has created the technicality.
    Grand Slam #1005 + 2: Dall (1986 Yukon), Fannin/Stone (1987 Yukon), Bighorn (1988 Colorado Unit S-26), Stone (1995 British Columbia), Desert (2001 Nevada Unit 161), Bighorn (2009 Wyoming Unit 5)

  4. #4
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    Hmmm, seems to me that if a copper-clad iron shot, or any shot that is copper coated, is approved, then a solid copper bullet would fit the bill.

    The link that MM attached advises: Nontoxic shot is defined as any shot type that does not cause sickness and death when ingested by migratory birds.

    One would assume that is copper plated steel shot isn't harmful, then solid copper would fit the bill as well. Of course, you know what happens when one assumes..

    Bottom line: I think copper qualifies as 'non-lead', but I'd get with Oregon game and fish to verify.
    My mind is a raging torrent, flooded with rivulets of thought cascading into a waterfall of creative alternatives.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fink View Post
    Hmmm, seems to me that if a copper-clad iron shot, or any shot that is copper coated, is approved, then a solid copper bullet would fit the bill.

    The link that MM attached advises: Nontoxic shot is defined as any shot type that does not cause sickness and death when ingested by migratory birds.

    One would assume that is copper plated steel shot isn't harmful, then solid copper would fit the bill as well. Of course, you know what happens when one assumes..

    Bottom line: I think copper qualifies as 'non-lead', but I'd get with Oregon game and fish to verify.
    This website listing "federally-approved nontoxic shot material" is specifically geared towards "NONTOXIC SHOT REGULATIONS FOR HUNTING WATERFOWL AND COOTS IN THE U.S" rather than non-toxic big game hunting bullets. Solid copper (Barnes) and gliding metal (Hornady) have been the materials typically used in non-toxic hunting bullets. I have a friend from ODFW working on clarifying this.
    Grand Slam #1005 + 2: Dall (1986 Yukon), Fannin/Stone (1987 Yukon), Bighorn (1988 Colorado Unit S-26), Stone (1995 British Columbia), Desert (2001 Nevada Unit 161), Bighorn (2009 Wyoming Unit 5)

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fink View Post
    Hmmm, seems to me that if a copper-clad iron shot, or any shot that is copper coated, is approved, then a solid copper bullet would fit the bill.

    The link that MM attached advises: Nontoxic shot is defined as any shot type that does not cause sickness and death when ingested by migratory birds.
    Does this mean I can't shoot a goose or duck that is flying directly at me....with it's mouth open? I'm sure a shot or 2 could go into it's mouth when I shoot and definitely cause sickness or death! LOL......
    Colorado Cowboy
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  8. #7
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    The Thor website also states "NOTE: BULLETS ARE CALIFORNIA CERTIFIED LEGAL NONLEAD ZONE"
    Grand Slam #1005 + 2: Dall (1986 Yukon), Fannin/Stone (1987 Yukon), Bighorn (1988 Colorado Unit S-26), Stone (1995 British Columbia), Desert (2001 Nevada Unit 161), Bighorn (2009 Wyoming Unit 5)

  9. #8
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    I would think the copper would be considered nontoxic since CA banned lead bullets claiming condors were dieing from eating lead bullets but since the copper bullets are legal and considered non toxic it must be ok for condors to eat them. Would think the new reg could just say if copper bullets were legal or give a definition of non toxic.
    "Now two flags fly above my land that really sum up how I fee. One is the colors that fly high and proud The red, the white, the blue. The other one's got a rattlesnake With a simple statement made "Don't tread on me" is what it says and I'll take that to my grave. Because this is me. I'm proud to be American and strong in my beliefs. And I've said it before but I'll say it again 'Cause my family's always fought and died to save this land. And a country boy is all I'll ever be."

 

 

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